Vent sent to Stitches South

[Afghaniac]

When I received the email announcing this event coming in April, I responded with this:

 

Until and unless you decide that crochet is an significant yarn craft, you can remove me from your email list. I attended once, and found nothing of interest to me. Every year I hope for a class in freeform crochet, for example, but no dice. Snubbing crocheters is self-defeating, since there are more crocheters than knitters. Knitting can be done by machine; crocheting cannot. Knitting historically was a utilitarian craft; crocheting a leisure

art. Finally, crocheting uses more

yarn than knitting. I could be wooed into using fancier yarns if I were pursued rather than snubbed by specialty yarn shops and Stitches events.

 

 

You may or may not agree, but I was again disappointed to see such a lack of interest in our yarn craft.

[kittyloverdeb]

You go girl!  Yeah!  What she said!  

[Avon Lady]

Super!  Let them know how we feel!

[Amy]

General reminder to everyone: Crochetville is not the place to post issues you are having with another business, especially if you have not yet contacted the business and given them time to respond to your concerns.

 

I am going to leave this post up, because Crochetville has been heavily involved with STITCHES Expos and XRX for the past three years. I staffed the Crochet Guild of America booth at all STITCHES events in 2011, when they began to make a serious effort to bring crochet into what had traditionally been a very knit-centric event. Crochetville had a vendor booth with Red Heart Yarns at all STITCHES events in 2012 and 2013.

In early 2011, a vocal group of crocheters raised a very huge stink about STITCHES not having many classes for crocheters. Benjamin Levisay, the CEO of XRX, engaged in an open dialogue with them, and really did a lot to encourage his vendors to have more crochet patterns and projects available on the show floor and to enter more crocheted garments in the fashion show. He has also made a concerted effort to bring crochet classes to the events, bringing in big-name designers such as Drew Emborsky, Kristin Omdahl, Marly Bird, Edie Eckman, Myra Wood, Jennifer Hansen, Ginger Luters, and others to teach crochet classes.

Did you realize there are a number of crochet classes available at STITCHES South next year? Here's the list:

 

Beginner:

Basic Crochet, Just for Lefties with Gwen Bortner

Easy Classes:

Foundation Stitches 101: The Basics with Marty Miller

Crochet Chart Sampler with Marly Bird

Tunisian Crochet 101 with Marty Miller

Designing Crochet Afghans with Stacey Trock

Template Based Knitting or Crochet with Myra Wood

 

Intermediate:

Around the Corner Crochet Borders with Edie Eckman

Extreme Tunisian with Marty Miller

Hobby to Profession: Becoming a Designer with Marly Bird

Shawls from All Angles with Marty Miller

Medallion Mania with Marly Bird

 

 

Advanced:

Getting Started with Japanese Crochet Patterns with Gayle Roehm

 

 

Yes, there is only one advanced class. Do you know the reason why? All the crocheters who begged and begged for STITCHES to include crochet classes have not followed through and actually showed up to take advantage of the classes being offered. Know who's taking the vast majority of the crochet classes: knitters who have finally recognized how great crochet is and are excited to expand their skills.

A show like this has a very difficult task when scheduling classes. In order to make money, you have to offer classes that will be attended by a good number of people. If you had a choice between offering a class that would sell all 25 seats or a class that would maybe sell 4 seats, which are you going to offer?

When you're trying to build a following of a new group of people, for awhile, you're going to be willing to take a loss and offer the classes with very few attendees. But you eventually need to see more and more people taking those classes, or you're going to have to stop offering them and go back to the classes that fill up and sell out.

I understand that if you're an advanced crocheter, you won't want to spend your hard-earned money taking classes that are much below your experience level. That's all right. But in that case, perhaps try to be part of a solution. What if you could organize a group of crochet friends who were also at an advanced level and get them all to commit to attending one particular STITCHES event, and each person to commit to taking a certain number of advanced classes, if STITCHES would actually offer those classes? This would take a lot of advance planning, probably at least a year out in advance, but that might be a way to convince STITCHES that advanced crochet classes could be worth their while to offer.

They aren't going to commit to a large number of advanced classes unless they know they have a large enough group of people who will take them. Perhaps once they're offered at one show, it could grow and snowball from there.

Instead of ranting at STITCHES, let's see if we can brainstorm ways to help them get more advanced crochet classes into their show. I'm going to invite Benjamin Levisay or someone else from STITCHES to come to this thread and talk with us.
 

[Afghaniac]

First, Amy, I stand corrected regarding the crochet classes planned at Stitches this year. I went back to their email and realized that somehow I only clicked on a partial list of the classes and scanned them too quickly and carelessly, probably focused too much on looking for  a freeform class.  However, that said, last year's conference had very little other than your booth for anybody other than knitters, though your displays were a good step toward changing that, and you and I discussed that while we were there. And I do appreciate that you've made inroads since then.

 

The last time I got a virtual tongue-lashing here, it was apparently for my tongue-in-cheek quip directed at unnamed yarn shop owners as knitwits for being disparaging of crochet. Since this is a what I thought was a public forum, I somehow thought that open, democratic discussions are allowed, as long as there's no nastiness. I did not realize that all money-making enterprises -- particularly those associated with the sponsors/administrators of this forum and even those which are unnamed-- are sacred cows exempt from any hint of criticism. I guess I'll have to hang out only at the many other websites where people can speak their minds -- amazon.com, for example, which is only one of many where consumers can freely critique the very products being sold on those sites. Even at ravelry.com, folks freely discuss problems they've had with patterns posted there.

 

This is your deal, and if I decide to and am allowed to stick around here, I'll go tippy-toe from now on.

[Amy]

I'm sorry you felt what I wrote was a virtual tongue-lashing, as that is not what I intended. I don't see anything I posted directed at you that could be considered a tongue-lashing, but sometimes it's hard to see how your own words are actually coming across to others. Please let me know which particular parts of my post are coming across too harsh to you, as I'll be happy to go back and edit if necessary. You're welcome to send this information to me via private message if you prefer.

 

Vents against other companies are usually not allowed, and you titled your post as a "vent" sent to STITCHES. (I'll post our policies at the end of this post for anyone who isn't clear on what they are for this type of situation). I sometimes do post public reminders of our policies within threads, as it serves as useful information for all forum members and helps make sure a thread stays on track with our policies.

 

Discussions without nastiness are indeed allowed here, when the discussion is based on facts. Discussions based on incorrect information can be detrimental to another business, as we've already seen in this thread. What you wrote caused at least two people to have a negative impression of STITCHES based on what you felt they were NOT doing for crocheters; perhaps more formed a negative opinion even though they didn't post anything. That is why I felt it was important to post what STITCHES really is doing to support crocheters. That doesn't mean their efforts are perfect, and that there aren't other things they could also do to help promote crochet.

 

If you would like to offer further constructive criticism about STITCHES and how it could be made a better event for crocheters, that discussion is very welcome here. However, it will be a discussion, in which people who hold disagreeing, perhaps even very opposite, opinions are all welcome to share their opinions.

 

Yes, I think STITCHES has made amazing progress in the past couple of years from being what was once pretty much a 100% knitting event. However, I still think there is room to do more. But they'll only do more, or continue even just what they're doing, if crocheters actually show up to their events and take advantage of the classes and let the vendors on the show floor know when they make a purchase that it's for a crochet project. It can't be just a few of us showing up; crocheters have to show up in large numbers to make it financially feasible for an organization to continue to devote resources to them over the long-term

 

On another note, STITCHES cannot control what their vendors have available on the show floor. If other companies with a strong focus on crochet wanted to have booths on the show floor, STITCHES would be happy to sell booth space to them. STITCHES South is the smallest show of them all, and does not yet have as much crochet content as the other shows, just because it's a smaller show. Some of the vendors who do have more crochet presence in their booth at other shows do not attend STITCHES South. There were a number of crochet classes at STITCHES South last year, too.

As far as the vendors, I'll tell you what one yarn company told me. They go to the expense of creating crochet patterns: paying the designer, donating the yarn, having the pattern tech edited, photo shoots, creating the pattern document, etc. Then, in one year, they don't even sell enough copies of the pattern or enough yarn (when pattern is included free) to make back the costs of producing the pattern. Whereas, with their knit patterns, they make back the production costs many times over very, very quickly.

 

The patterns are promoted at the shows, to yarn stores, etc. But the crocheters aren't buying them. And the particular pattern I'm speaking of was created by a very popular crochet designer in a design that should appeal fairly widely to crocheters.

When that happens, can you blame a yarn company for not devoting more of their limited resources to crocheters?

 

So is there a solution? Is there anything we, as crocheters who would like to see more crochet patterns available for yarn store yarns, do anything to help get more crochet at the event? How can we convince the yarn companies there really are enough of us out here who will buy their patterns and their yarn? How can we determine if there really are enough of us out here to make it worthwhile for the yarn companies to focus more of their efforts on us?

 

[Amy]

Forgot to post our relevant Community Policies in the previous post, so here they are.

 

 

 

Customer Service

• Please do not use Crochetville to attempt to resolve customer service disputes. The proper thing to do is contact the business owner first.
• Please be respectful when discussing crochet- and fiber-related small businesses. The owner or employees of the business may be reading your posts.
• If you must post a review that contains negative feedback, please remember that you may be affecting someone's livelihood. Please post appropriately and constructively.
• Libelous comments are not allowed, and could result in legal action being taken against you by a business owner. Factual statements that you can back up with evidence are not libelous.
• If you are mad at a business, its owner, or an employee for some reason, you may not use Crochetville to attempt to do harm. Attempts at doing so (our call) will result in deletion of posts, possible loss of posting privileges, and potentially being banned from the site.
•  

[Avon Lady]

 

You pose some interesting questions here, Amy!  Does anyone have any suggestions what we crocheters can do to convince the yarn companies that we are out here, and want to "be heard", or "seen", or whatever it takes for them to start recognizing that we love our art?  I would love to go to all these shows you speak of, but I am on a very limited budget and do not have the time or money to  travel to them!  Maybe they could come to some of OUR simple little Crafts Shows, and see how many of us make beautiful items!

[Amy]

Avon Lady, I believe the yarn companies already recognize that crocheters deeply love their art. That is not in question. The yarn companies know there are millions and millions of crocheters out there. The latest industry surveys show there are actually quite a few more crocheters than knitters.

The problem is that the big majority of crocheters spend their money on craft store  yarns, not yarn store yarns. Most yarn store owners will tell you that the amount of yarn they sell for crochet projects is a teeny tiny percentage of  all the yarn they sell. Until crocheters start spending a much higher dollar volume of yarn in yarn stores, the number of crochet patterns put out by yarn companies is going to remain a small fraction of the patterns they put out for knitters.

The yarn industry, just like any other, is driven by money. Companies are going to put their limited resources into the products that are going to give the the most return for their bucks. They can't afford to  put their money into products from which they cannot make back their original investment, let alone turn a profit.

I don't see the purpose to yarn companies attending craft shows. If they did, they'd just see that the vast preponderance of crocheted items available there are made from craft store yarns. That wouldn't help convince the brands that are sold in yarn stores to make more crochet patterns available in their yarns.

The only way to get these companies interested in making more patterns available for crocheters is for crocheters to start spending more money on yarn stores yarns and to start letting the companies know how much they are spending on their yarns.

Does anybody else have any thoughts on the subject?



 

[Afghaniac]

Well, Amy, if verbiage alone could kill . . . your responses have certainly succeeded. The quantity itself is overwhelming, and, of course, the points you make are unassailable. And, no, I have not read the cited rules of posting at Crochetville. Silly me, I didn’t realize where I was, and thought that if I didn’t bully, threaten, or swear, I was pretty much following “the rules.” I forgot that the Internet now is all about dollars and that this is not simply a cozy little craft website where an old woman can grouse about yarn and stuff once in a while without being accused of launching, with a few careless words,  a devastating assault on American capitalism. It is, of course, a for-profit operation. Nothing wrong  with shilling for companies, but on other corporate-sponsored websites, comments are not monitored or censored to this extent ,  and  there is free give-and-take between customers and vendors.  At other sites, when customers critique specific products or vendors, the word libel generally is not used.  I will stay away from a site over which, I now understand, hovers the threat of being sued for libel. Not fun. 

[Amy]

Kay, your comments are inflammatory and have been designed to paint Crochetville in a negative light, so I'm going to address them publicly to make sure people reading this thread have an accurate picture of what Crochetville is about.

 

1. If anyone thinks my posts are too long, feel free to skim them or ignore them. You won't hurt my feelings.

 

2. I make no claims that any opinions I've shared are unassailable, although some things I said are factual. It is hard to argue with facts.

 

3. Just as you were unaware of our posting policies, I think you're probably unaware that many other sites also have policies against libelous speech. Ravelry actually uses the word libel; Amazon uses the terms "defamatory" or "otherwise injurious to a third party." Everyone should realize that this language is common to the policies and terms of use/terms of service of most business sites that have had their site policies reviewed by their attorney.

 

4. I agree that posts here may appear to be monitored more closely than on a site like amazon, but that's because Crochetville is so much smaller than amazon. However, we do not actively monitor every post made here at Crochetville. We have neither the time nor the inclination to do so. We encourage members to report posts that they feel may violate our policies. The original post in this thread was reported to us. I read it, and then responded just as I would have if I had read the post myself before it was reported. (Ravelry and Amazon, for example, also respond to posts that are reported to them.)

5. You have not been censored in any way. Your post was not removed. Your post was not edited. You have not been asked to stop discussing the situation. On the contrary, I've asked for a continuation of the conversation about how STITCHES could be made even better for crocheters. The free give-and-take between consumers and vendors that you desire is actually being encouraged here.

 

6. I am not shilling for another company. All I have done is make sure that accurate information is provided and provide information I have as a result of personal conversations with people associated with companies involved. That cannot be construed as shilling in any way.

 

If anyone reading this has any concerns whatsoever about Crochetville's policies, you are more than welcome to send me a private message or use the Contact Us form to voice your concerns. We'd be very happy to hear your opinions and talk with you.

I am going to suggest that this thread return to the original topic of what STITCHES is doing for crocheters. If you've been to a STITCHES event, let's talk about what you saw available there for crocheters. If you've been to the STITCHES website, received their emails, or read through their registration booklet, share ideas on what more you think STITCHES could do for crocheters.

[Avon Lady]

The problem is that the big majority of crocheters spend their money on craft store  yarns, not yarn store yarns. Most yarn store owners will tell you that the amount of yarn they sell for crochet projects is a teeny tiny percentage of  all the yarn they sell. Until crocheters start spending a much higher dollar volume of yarn in yarn stores, the number of crochet patterns put out by yarn companies is going to remain a small fraction of the patterns they put out for knitters.

Amy. the reason I spend my money on craft store yarns is because I am on a limited budget, that just barely pays my utility bills!  I would dearly LOVE to be able to walk into a yarn store and pick out some of the beautiful yarns for the afghans and prayer shawls and hats that my crochet club and I make for charity!  But alas!!  I cannot!  

[Amy]

Collette, I totally understand that many crocheters and knitters are on a budget. That's one of the reasons I thought it was important for Crochetville to partner with Red Heart Yarns to make their yarns available for purchase on the show floor at STITCHES and the Knit and Crochet Show. Since we began selling for Red Heart, Lion Brand has begun to sell their Lion Brand Studio yarns and a very small selection of their other yarns at the shows. Spinrite, the Canadian company that owns Bernat/Patons/Caron/Lily, does not sell at the US shows. Neither do the craft stores that have their own store brands of yarn, and it's not likely that they ever will.

 

Some of the yarn-store yarn companies have crochet patterns available and finished garments on display in their booths. Some of the local yarn stores also have crochet garments on display as well as crochet hooks, patterns, and books for sale.

 

Believe me, the Crochetville booth itself is 4 booths of crochet awesomeness at the shows: many crocheted garments made from Red Heart yarns on display, plus a very good selection of crochet books and individual patterns, Susan Bates aluminum and steel bamboo handle hooks, large size knitting needles for broomstick lace, hairpin lace loom, and even gift items for crocheters.

 

I'd like to know what more it is crocheters want to see at the shows. If you've been to the shows, tell me exactly what else you'd like to see there. Are there different yarns you want to see there? More hooks? If so, which ones? Do you want some of the companies already there to have more crochet patterns available for their yarns? If so, which ones? Once I have a better idea of what people want to see, I may be able to tell you what it might take to get that to happen, based on conversations I've had with others in the industry.

 

If you haven't been to a show yet, tell me what you'd want to see there. Perhaps what you want is already available. Perhaps it isn't. And like above, I may have some insight into what it would take to make it available.

 

Or maybe I'll have no clue how to get what you want incorporated into the shows.

[Sylviaf]

I certainly want to see more crochet specific things: patterns, especially, but classes, tools and samples, too. I usually attend Stitches Midwest because it is held in my town. Generally I attend with my daughter and really feel pretty much excluded, although I enjoy the beautiful yarns, but it is obviously aimed at knitters. My daughter is a knitter and always finds more than she could hope to make while (except for the beautiful yarns which I can find in local stores) there is little for me. She was unavailable to attend the most recent event and I didn't even bother going. I really think that if the vendors would actually try to appeal to us, more crocheters would love to open their wallets, but I don't see why we should be grateful and jump at the crumbs we are thrown. Crochetville is the exception not the rule; it is like going to the mall in hopes of finding plus-size (or tall or maybe petite) clothing when everything is geared to average. Why waste my time in places that don't cater to my needs? We go to craft stores because we are as likely to find our tools and pattern books at Michael's (or Joann's, Hobby Lobby, etc.) as knitters are. I can't tell you specifically what I want because I don't know what the possibilities are. I want the same options knitters have: show me what I can crochet with the beautiful yarns out there and don't treat me as an afterthought. Don't have twenty patterns for knitters and a token poncho pattern for the crocheters. This sounds angry, but I am not, really. I just understand why so many people are frustrated. I can see the effort that Amy puts into promoting crochet but I feel like we have to beg other people to even recognize our existence. I also appreciate that this site is well moderated because we seem to avoid the nastiness of so many other places, but this topic of feeling excluded by the yarn world (or getting token recognition) seems like a valid concern. It isn't just the Stitches events, it is really a more pervasive feeling that knitters get to have nice things and we can just go make our potholders.

[Amy]

Sylvia, it's sort of a catch-22 situation. I've spoken with many yarn companies that have made a variety of crochet patterns available in their yarns, but the crocheters are just not buying the patterns or the yarns to make the items (when pattern is given free with purchase) in anywhere near the amount that knitters purchase any individual knit pattern that the company offers.

Is it that the crochet patterns the companies already have available just don't appeal to crocheters? I have a challenge for anyone who would like to participate.

CHALLENGE:

1. Pick a yarn-store yarn manufacturer/distributor whose yarns you would like to use in crochet projects.

2. Go to their website and look at all the crochet patterns they have available.

3. Come back and tell us:

 

A. Which of the patterns they already have that you would actually want to make (feel free to link to them)

 

B. Whether you would make the project in their yarn or a cheaper yarn

C. If you really would use their yarn, approximate time you might be purchasing the yarn and pattern (knowing you might have to work the project into your queue or budget for the yarn)

 

D. How many of this company's patterns do you think you'd make in a year?

 

E. If you wouldn't make any of the crochet patterns they currently have available, tell us why you wouldn't make those particular patterns and the types of patterns you would actually make: type and style of project, size range you need, which of their yarns you'd prefer the pattern to be written for, etc.

[mattenylou]

Answering the Challenge-

 

from Premier yarns , I know i'll make this baby afghan, it uses their Big Ball, a really nice quality yarn, comes in a pound skein .. makes a nice $10 baby gift...  Probably will put in a big yarn order with them right after the New Year.

 

Cabled slipper socks.... will make soon, it's cold feet season! I'll use some yarn i have here in the stash, probably Premiers Ever Soft ... I love this yarn, nice and soft, but thick and the price is right, too... best inexpensive yarn there is, I think.

 

I might give this chunky basket  a go, making a couple or 5 in different colors, I've had my eye on this pattern for 6 months and have had the yarns for at least twice as long... using up some old stash that is too coarse to do anything else with, or some old Red Heart I have here,

 

This Doggie coat looks good, and I need to start this in the next few days. I have DeborahNorville's yarn here already and in red... perfect!

 

That's just a quick glance at the Premier patterns,  I always check there first, then poke around Lion brand next...  I know I'll be making 5 afghans this year and at least 10 hats, a couple of sweaters or vests, some mittens, some scarves, some baby things, also some knit socks and mittens, too. and a bunch of doilies,,, I may use 10 of their over 200 crochet patterns.

 

I make whatever I decide to start that morning... if I have the yarn, fine, If I don't I may order it or put it off til I have a good sized yarn order. I usually do a pretty big yarn order every other month to get the afghan/sweater yarns I need and then just get some odds and ends to add to the stash. I always get a couple of Big Balls in basic colors to have on hand for adding stripes, or trim or making a few smaller projects,, just so handy to have and it's a nicer quality than some of the pound skeins.

 

I'm a pattern collector.. I've got 40 years of patterns and books here... Seems I go back to the old stand-bys, tho, when it comes down to actually picking up the hook and yarn, I know the sweater patterns that work for me, and the hats and mittens I can do with just a glance at the pattern because I've made so many of them. I usually only look for a pattern if It's for something I haven't made in a while or I want to try something new.. I'm a firm believer is staying with the old tried and true patterns, that I know will work without driving me crazy. If I can't easily figure it out, I'll just drop it and find another pattern that works,... it amazes me how I see people struggle with the first few rows of a poorly written pattern when there are so many available.

 

Just a note- Stitches East was just a half hour away and the previous weekend was the New England Fiber Festival, about 5 minutes from my house. I considered going to each of them, especially seeing how people were traveling from all over the country to get here. I could have put on my knitter's hat and wandered thru, but I'm now only a sock and mitten knitter, everything else I crochet. I still don't like the way we crocheters are treated at yarn stores, and I have tossed my sock yarn selections back on their counter after hearing their snide remarks when choosing yarn for a crocheted vest or sweater... I can get all the help I need to pick out a single ball of sock yarn, but as soon as I mention I need 10 skeins to *crochet* a vest, everything changes... Oh well, thankfully I can buy all the yarn I want online. They don't seem to care if I use a hook or 2 needles, my money is still green to them.

[Amy]

Mattenylou, thank you for taking the time for the challenge. However, the challenge isn't for craft store yarns, it's for yarn store yarns.

People keep saying they want the yarn store brands that are vendors at Stitches to make more patterns available for crocheters. These companies aren't going to make more crochet patterns available until people start spending money on the patterns (and yarn!) they already make available.

I'm trying to figure out if people just aren't familiar with all the crochet patterns these companies may already have, if there is something about the patterns they do have that they don't like, what types of patterns they want these companies to offer instead of or in addition to what they already offer.

I also want to know if people would actually follow through if what they say they want is actually made available, and actually purchase what they've been asking for.

Crocheters talk an awful lot about wanting more patterns, more conferences/retreats, more variety of whatever. Yet, when these things are made available, there is often no resulting follow-through in purchasing those items.

We crocheters cannot be the little kid who cries wolf. If we, as a group, insist strongly that we want something, when the companies give us what we've asked for, we as a group have to purchase their offerings. Or they're going to stop listening to us and stop trying to meet our requests.

[Amy]

Mattenylou, I'm so sorry to hear you've had that type of experience in yarn stores. I can't imagine any yarn store owner looking down on any customer who wants to purchase their yarn, regardless of why they want it. As a good businessperson, they should make every potential purchaser feel welcomed and valued. It doesn't matter whether they want to crochet, knit, weave, hook rugs, tie flies for fishing, make dreadlocks, make child's toys, whatever.

You need to come down and visit in the yarn stores in my area. They're all very welcoming and appreciative of crocheters, at least the ones I've been in.

[craftyone]

There are no "yarn stores" here in Queens, NY that carry the higher end yarns. I carry Red Heart, Lion brand, Bernat, Sugar and cream

in my shop. I try to cater to crocheters and find that most people in my neighborhood only want basic yarns like RH Super Saver. I order some of the RH Boutique yarns and end up using them myself to make projects that I sell completed in my shop. I find that people at least in my area can't or don't want to spend much on yarn and mostly only want the Free patterns that the yarn companies provide. Years back, I sold a lot of books, when most were priced under $5.00. Now that so many books are $15 and up, people think longer about purchasing books. It would be nice if some of the higher end yarn companies would have "starter packs" or sample packs that a small store could order to see what the response would be before committing to a large order and finding it doesn't sell in that area. I haven't been to any of the shows yet, but have plans to go to the CGOA show in Manchester in July.

[papersmiles]

OK, I am a little confused as to "where" I should go to check out Yarn Store yarns.  Do you mean physically go to a LYS?  That isn't very likely where I live.  No LYS's anywhere near.  How about on-line Yarn Stores like Bernat or Willow?  I do like quite a few of the patterns at on-line yarn companies.  

 

The most discouraging thing for me is to find that the high end yarns are usually packaged in very small (ounces/yards) skeins.  So, even if I LOVE the feel, look and drape of a yarn, when the price of a single skein is over $5.00 and the pattern calls for 15-20 skeins (sweaters, shrugs, shawls, vests) I shutter at paying so much for yarn and "hoping" the finished product comes out the way I visualize it so that it might justify (sort of...lol) the cost.  

 

I have never had the opportunity to visit a fiber fest where Stitches might be present but I certainly would like too.  What exactly IS "Stitches"?  Even though I am primarily a crocheter, I am learning to knit more confidently as I try out my new skills, limited as they are.  I have to admit to being a yarn junkie and love to visit ANY BOOTHS or STORES that have yarn.  Fortunately, I have not encountered some of the the less than welcoming attitudes mentioned here and I am thankful.  I personally think that all fiber artists should feel connected in some way by a love of craft and a need to create.  

 

Barbara

[Amy]

Barbara, I'm going to start by describing what the knit and crochet shows like STITCHES are like. Then I'll make another post explaining more about the challenge.

 

The two big shows that would draw the interest of crocheters are STITCHES Expos and the Knit & Crochet Show. The Knit & Crochet Show (the vendor floor) is part of the conferences (classes) of the Crochet Guild of America and The Knitting Guild Association. STITCHES holds 4 events each year, always in the same locations and general timeframes: February in Santa Clara, CA; April in Atlanta, GA; August in Schaumburg, IL, and October in Hartford, CT. STITCHES Expos are put together by a knitting company called XRX, that publishes a magazine and some really good knitting books. In 2011, STITCHES began working with crocheters, adding crochet classes to their schedule, and encouraging their vendors to add more crochet products to their booths. For the past couple of years, the K&CS has had two conferences a year, but in 2014, there will only be one: in Manchester, NH at the end of July. It's also the 20th anniversary of CGOA. Because it is also the conference for the two organizations, the K&CS is about 50/50 crocheters/knitters in attendance, while STITCHES is still predominantly knitters.

 

At both shows, you can take a variety of crochet classes, although you'll find more total classes and more variety at the Knit & Crochet Show. Hopefully, more and more crocheters will also start attending STITCHES classes, enabling them to expand their class offerings.

 

Both shows also feature evening activities such as a dinner banquet and fashion show, pajama party, CGOA Fun Night (with games, show and tell, etc), and other fun things to do.

 

Both events also offer a vendor floor where companies set up booths and bring in yarn, hooks, knitting needles, tools, fiber, spinning wheels (at some shows, not all), books, patterns, gifts, etc. The vast majority of vendors are companies whose products are sold in local yarn stores or are indie dyers who sell directly on their own websites.

 

The events also feature and Knit & Crochet Lounge where you can just sit and hang out with others who are working on their projects. There's usually a lounge close to the show floor and people also hang out and crochet or knit in the hotel lobby. There's always a group you can join if you've come to the show on your own.

 

On a smaller scale, we also have Crochetville's 10th Anniversary Crochet Retreat being held Feb 27 - Mar 2, 2014, in Huntsville, AL. Since this is a retreat, it's a bit different. It's an opportunity to spend a whole weekend with a bunch of crocheting friends, hanging out and crocheting. We have a pretty good selection of classes being offered by well-known designers and instructors. Because it's a small retreat (maximum of 60 attendees), we will only have a very small vendor area, basically made up of vendors who are within driving distance or who otherwise wanted to attend the retreat and be a part of it. We just don't have enough attendees to justify a large vendor floor. I'm hoping a lot of our Crochetville members will register for this retreat. Donna and I would dearly love the chance to get to know you all in person.

[magiccrochetfan]

OK, I am a little confused as to "where" I should go to check out Yarn Store yarns.  Do you mean physically go to a LYS?  That isn't very likely where I live.  No LYS's anywhere near.  How about on-line Yarn Stores like Bernat or Willow?  I do like quite a few of the patterns at on-line yarn companies.  

 

The most discouraging thing for me is to find that the high end yarns are usually packaged in very small (ounces/yards) skeins.  So, even if I LOVE the feel, look and drape of a yarn, when the price of a single skein is over $5.00 and the pattern calls for 15-20 skeins (sweaters, shrugs, shawls, vests) I shutter at paying so much for yarn and "hoping" the finished product comes out the way I visualize it so that it might justify (sort of...lol) the cost.  

 

I'm jumping in here to give my answer to the question about LYS-type yarns.  You can get a good idea of the range of brands by looking at a web site such as Webs http://www.yarn.com/webs-knitting-crochet-yarns-brand/  Valley Yarns is their house brand, and the rest of the brands they sell could be found in LYS.  However, I have to say that whenever I travel to my "L"YS (an hour drive away) I see yarns that I have never heard of before, or maybe read about but not seen for sale online, so if you do get the chance to go to an LYS it can be really interesting.   Other big online sellers are Yarnmarket, Jimmy Beans Wool, Patternworks, Paradise Fibers, Loopy Ewe...and there are many more.  LYS also sell yarn produced by small companies that make yarn and /or dye it.  

 

2 LYS brands that have more-moderately priced yarns are Cascade and Plymouth.  

 

Knit Picks is a company that sells online and features their own brand of more inexpensive yarns; Willow seems to be similar.  Bernat is sold in big-box craft stores like Joanns, and at Walmart, so it would not be an LYS yarn.  

[Amy]

Okay, now for the challenge. I meant pick your favorite yarn store brand yarn, go to that company's website, and take a look at all the crochet patterns they have available for that yarn and their other yarns. Then answer the questions. No trip to a local yarn store needed. The research can all be done online.

Most vendors at STITCHES are either yarn stores local to the event (usually just a couple), a few larger yarn stores that go to all the STITCHES events (a dozen or so, maybe), indie yarn dyers and tool makers, and then companies whose products are generally carried in local yarn stores and not in the big chain craft or discount stores.

People have complained about the vendors at STITCHES not having enough products of interest to crocheters. So I want people to respond to the challenge about the companies likely to be vendors at STITCHES. If anyone needs help in selecting a yarn company, you can go to the Vendor List for STITCHES East 2013 to see who had a booth there.

Willow and Bernat do not exhibit at STITCHES, so I don't need information about them.

Do the crocheters who say there isn't enough for crocheters at STITCHES really mean they want to see 50/50 crochet and knitting products? That won't happen until 1) a particular company's customer base is a 50/50 split and 2) the attendees at a particular event are 50/50 split.

Or have they just not seen what is available at STITCHES for crocheters?

Or are they just complaining about lack of availability because that's easier than admitting they just aren't going to purchase yarn store brand yarns and patterns no matter what is available due to the price factor?

Or is there something else that they want, and I'm just not understanding what they're asking for?

[Amy]

More and more LYS seem to be carrying a variety of indie-produced yarns. With these big online stores carrying the yarns from the larger companies such as Cascade and Plymouth, and often offering some pretty significant bulk purchase discounts, it can be hard for the LYS to compete with that.

Willow Yarns is Herrschner's own house-brand yarn.

[craftyone]

Looked at Fiesta yarns and Trendsetters and was disappointed to see only about a dozen crochet patterns available for Fiesta yarns and not 1 crochet pattern for trendsetter. Even many of the ribbon yarns have so many knit patterns but hardly any for crochet. If customers don't want to create their own patterns, the yarn companies need to offer more patterns for crocheters. Red Heart offers a large selection of crochet patterns. Some of the other companies should follow Red Heart and offer more crochet patterns if they hope to attract crocheters to their yarns. If they only offer knit patterns, they are not going to get crocheters interested in their yarns.