Crocheting a knitted border

[KerrieS]

Hello all I do hope you can help! I am a knitter, not a crocheter but have recently learnt some basic skills to apply as edgings to my knits. My current project is a knitted “Chanel” style jacket which has four rows of edging. This will go around the whole jacket (back and fronts) and pocket tops and sleeves,

the Four rows are: 

• slip stitch
• double crochet (UK)
• double crochet
• crab stitch.

so my question is: am I working these rows continuously, what I would call “ in the round” with right side of fabric always facing me? This is my assumption. This would mean doing it differently for the pocket tops though.. if I turn to work the new row, will it look different? I feel this is an extremely dumb question (the pattern doesn’t specify) but I don’t have any intuitive understanding of crochet common sense as I do from knitting..as I have only crocheted once (teaching myself from you tube) to make a similar border which was though just one row dc and then one row crab stitch. Thanks for any advice you can share!

[bgs]

Can you tell us exactly what the pattern says on how to do the border?  You can turn your work when working rounds.  You make a round, turn it over and work back the other way.  We do that with granny squares sometimes to keep them from looking wonky due to skew in crochet stitches. 

[KerrieS]

This is the relevant bit of the instructions - detail is sparse!! and a picture of the garment.

[bgs]

Actually the instructions aren't too bad. I dont think it is going to be noticeable between the pocket and jacket if you do rounds on jacket and rows on pocket because a row of sl st and 2 rows of sc are not going to create a big enough piece to see much especially since the last row has you inserting your hook 2 rows below which is going to cover those rows of sc.  You are really only going to be able to see that last row.  If you are really afraid its going to look too different then turn the jacket after each row/round.  I just dont think its going to be that noticeable since its so few rows and that last row is laying on top of the 2 rows of sc.  

The thing to be mindful of in turning and working in rows is to make sure that the last decorative row winds up on outside of pocket and jacket.  And in thinking about the turns for each row  remember for that last row since its crab stitch you will not be turning but working across in reverse.

Lets see what ideas some other people might have.

Edited April 19, 2023 by bgs

[Granny Square]

I concur with Bgs.  I knit, but have only crocheted around 1 thing (a cardigan).  My edge stitches were slipped while knitting because I'd been planning ahead to edge it in crochet, and this gave me a base to work into, so I didn't need to do an initial row of slip stitches. 

I ended up having to do some sort of scheme to get the stiches to lie flat because the dimensions weren't the same - meaning for example I ended up adding or subtracting a stitch every so often (I can't recall which way it went, or it might have gone 1 way on the vertical edges and another on the horizontal hem.)  For adding, I crocheted 2 stitches into 1, for subtracting I did a '2 together' so I didn't have any skipped stitches, if that makes sense.

If you are turning a corner, as I did transitioning from fronts to hem, in the corner stitch try putting 1 crab stitch, 1 chain, 1 crab stitch into the corner - this keeps the corner flat, the chain makes the corner turn sharper.

[KerrieS]

8 hours ago, Granny Square said:

I concur with Bgs.  I knit, but have only crocheted around 1 thing (a cardigan).  My edge stitches were slipped while knitting because I'd been planning ahead to edge it in crochet, and this gave me a base to work into, so I didn't need to do an initial row of slip stitches. 

I ended up having to do some sort of scheme to get the stiches to lie flat because the dimensions weren't the same - meaning for example I ended up adding or subtracting a stitch every so often (I can't recall which way it went, or it might have gone 1 way on the vertical edges and another on the horizontal hem.)  For adding, I crocheted 2 stitches into 1, for subtracting I did a '2 together' so I didn't have any skipped stitches, if that makes sense.

If you are turning a corner, as I did transitioning from fronts to hem, in the corner stitch try putting 1 crab stitch, 1 chain, 1 crab stitch into the corner - this keeps the corner flat, the chain makes the corner turn sharper.

Thanks for this. One of the things I’m confused about is the slip stitch chain is clearly visible in the photo, in fact it’s like a decorative feature. If I do my single crochet row into it, it disappears?!? 

[bgs]

I studied the photo and see what you mean.  I pulled out my crochet hook and crocheted a bit.  I dont think you make your sc row into the slip stitch row.  It looks like you slip stitch into your knitting.  Then it looks like your first row of sc is also made into your knitting which leaves the slip stitch laying on the surface.  The effect looks like what we call surface slip stitch but in that case piece is completed and you add it on the surface.  In this pattern you go ahead and slip stitch and then you go ahead and extend your work on up behind or under it.  

Calling Granny Square for consult!

Edited April 20, 2023 by bgs

[KerrieS]

This is really helpful and at last makes sense. I guess you could even do the slip stitch last if they are not really connected/ dependent in any way? I’ve just attached another photo, from the webpage about the “conception” of the design - does it help confirm your theory? I’m so enormously grateful for your knowledge and generosity of time in helping me!

[bgs]

Its much easier to see the stitches in this one.  You can clearly see front and back loops of slip stitches so the sc's are definitely not worked into slip stitches so it probably would be easier and look nicer worked last as surface slip stitches.  With that in mind you would sc into the knitting.  Do your next row of sc and then the crab stitches. This photo shows the crab stitch row really well.  You can see it alternates, one stitch worked in previous row as normal, next stitch is worked by inserting hook 2 rows down.

Important thing will be to start your first row of sc with the correct side of your knitting facing you so that the pretty side of the stitch is on outside/right side of your sweater.  If you are working in rounds then it would be the right/outside of sweater facing you.  If you work in rows and are turning (pockets) I think you want to put the first row of sc on with the wrong side/inside of sweater facing you.  Think it thru AND PLEASE HELP ME HERE GRANNY SQUARE as I might be wrong. I easily get confused at times. If you start with wrong side facing you sc row and turn.  Then right side is facing you sc next row.  You would not turn to work crab stitch thus leaving right side facing you.

[Granny Square]

I didn't catch that 'surface slip stitch' look on the photo, that's pretty clever and I don't think it would have occurred to me to get the look the way the designer did.  I agree I'd have chosen to do the surface slip stitch later (probably only because I'm familiar with it), but either works. 

KerrieS, speaking 'knit' now rather than crochet, did you slip the first stitch of every row of your knitting?  This is embarrassing, I do knit but not a whole lot and very intermittently and mostly in the round (sweaters and sox), and I can't remember without pulling out my needles and experimenting, if you slip knitwise or purlwise (I'm guessing the latter? ) at the beginning of every turned row to get a crochet-chain looking edging  working flat.  If you did, you can use 1 loop of the chain to slip stitch around to get the white edging, and the other loop of the chain to make the other part.  I hope this makes sense?

Here is a tutorial if you want to try slip stitch crochet, it is really easy https://www.crochetspot.com/how-to-crochet-surface-crochet-or-surface-slip-stitch/

[KerrieS]

Hi again. I wanted to let you know that I contacted the designer who assured me that the pattern was as read. So I’ve worked a very rough sample and yes, it works. The main difficulty I am having, and I’d appreciate any advice, is on maintaining a nice even tension on the stitches in the crab stitch. When you do a crochet stitch it somehow doesn’t feel to me as though there is any elasticity with which to do the gentle tug on stitches which evens things up. I guess it’s not helping that I am using a ribbon yarn, which is meant to be held double. This is my sample, and I have used the black yarn single, just to be sure the pattern reads this way. I’m still undecided, given the challenges - and I haven’t even tried working on the curved areas! - whether I am biting off more than I can chew. ( I think I’ve made an error too on stitch 5, but this was just to get the hang of it. )

 

[Granny Square]

If you think about it, the edge shouldn't need elasticity; your cuffs are 'split' looking at the drawing so it doesn't look like there'd be an issue with the cuff being tight.  The pockets might be an issue.  

I've used the crab stitch on non-wearables (pot holders, decorative things) and never thought about the stretch; it's only meant for edges; you can't easily crochet another row INTO it,, or I suppose anything is possible but it's 'not made for that'.

Your tension on the black edging could use a little practice, but I imagine that yarn is hard to work with.  It also sort of doesn't look quite right, but it might be the yarn; with 'normal' yarn, that stitch should look like a twisted rope.  It sort of looks like you have chosen a 'wrong spot' to make every other stitch, the bottom edge should look even.  Here is a video from Planet June, she has a lot of great tips on her site.

A thought that would only take a minute to try - turn it around (so you can work forward, it will be on the wrong side, but this is just a short test) - try working a few stitches of black into the white with a regular SC stitch, which is a perfectly reasonable choice to use as an edge.  Does that look better to you?  You might be happier with that look.

[bgs]

I just want to point out that in this pattern the bottom edges of the crab stitches are NOT even because it has you working every other crab stitch inserting hook 2 rows down.  

I havent worked crab stitch much but when I did it took some practice stitches to get it right.  I think you said this stuff was stiff and thats going to make it more challenging.  Plus it might be more prone to damage when trying to undo it.  I think you are doing great and are so close to getting this. 

[Granny Square]

Oops, I didn't look at the pattern for the stitch placement, that seems a little odd and every other stitch can't help but be tighter than the prior row, hmm.  

It is a pain of a stitch for the first few stitches, I like the look of it but my brain complains every time I do it (STOP!  you are going the wrong way!!) until I get it to shut up and sit  down.

Sometimes when you are making a border, especially into the edges of stitches, you have to fudge the count; it may depend on the aspect ratio of your stitches, compared to the designer.  I might be tempted to try 3 scenarios (1) not to double-strand the black, but single strand it --It's just decoration (not structural) here (2) try a crab stitch in every stitch (3) make a crab every other stitch with a chain-1 between, it shouldn't be tighter and shouldn't affect the appearance much. You can do this without ripping any prior work out, just a test; if it doesn't work, you are just out a little time. 

[Granny Square]

I just ran across your post with the same question on Ravelry, and someone suggested the 'cheat' crab stitch, which I'd forgotten about, where you work in the 'correct' direction but twirl the hook around - video

I know you've already seen the above, but just FYI for others that come across this thread.  I still think I'd experiment with the variations I mentioned above; I don't recall ever doing it other than in every stitch across (#2).

[KerrieS]

There are lots of great ideas and things to digest here. I do think a major source of my difficulty is the nature of the yarn and that it’s meant to be worked double. If you’re not very experienced, there is just so much going on. When I worked it double it was bulky and though the twist was happening it wasn’t looking great. Single, I could see me getting there eventually with a LOT of perseverance, but as bgs mentioned, the yarn doesn’t take kindly to lots of times being pulled out, it’s inclined to snag.

my current plan is to experiment with the sleeve edging. This at least introduces the element of the curve as well. I will try:

• Pattern as written, but black single strand. I’ll be more meticulous about getting that downward second stitch into the right spot, and will try the “twist” cheat crab stitch.
• doing just single crochet edge or plain crab stitch.

I feel like I’ve had friends (knowledgeable ones too) coming along this journey with me and thank you for all the kind and very thoughtful responses. I hope I don’t have to report back that I gave in and just did a garter stitch border!!!

[KerrieS]

Ok, I have decided the best look that doesn’t totally fry my brain is to do a crab stitch finish, with a single strand of yarn. I feel it looks ok. What I’m not sure of is crocheting this sloped edges and corners. There are videos on doing a sharp corner where as I understand it you do 2-3 into one stitch. My question is, as there are TWO rows of single crochet, do you do the same when you come to the corner again in the second row? And when you are doing a curve, as in the sleeves in my photos above, what’s the best solution? I made an occasional extra chain in one of my umpteen samples, does that work?

[bgs]

At this point you are going to need to do what looks best to you.  In looking at the photo it looks like they were able to continue the stitch without any changes going around the curves.  You may have to make a stitch or two, pull them out and readjust, make them again and move on.  I sometimes have to do this on afghans when adding a border.