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Sherri Hicks

Paton's Matinee Coat C4621 help

13 posts in this topic

I am trying to crochet a matinee sweater and am having trouble with the stitch count on the pattern.  The pattern is Paton's C4621 and I have finished up to Row 7 with 128 sts.  I am right up to here but where it says to divide for back thus is where I am having the problem, it says: with WS facing miss 24 sts, rejoin yarn in next st, 3 ch, 1 tr in first st, 1 tr in each of next 38 sts, 2 tr in next st, turn (42 sts)--I have done this but when I get to the next section Cont for Left Front thus: With WS facing, miss 24 st rejoin yarn in next st, 3 ch , 1 tr in first st, 1 tr in each st to end, turn (21 sts)--I do not have enough stitches left to make 21 sts---Where am I supposed to start counting the 24 sts for the back-- If anyone has made this coat could you please help or anyone else that could give me some insight into this.

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Hi and welcome to the 'ville!  The Board Help section is where you'd post if you were having some sort of issues with accessing the site - just mentioning this because there is another sub section of the forum for pattern help, and more pattern helpers might see your question there, and not scroll all the way down here :) .

I assume this is a baby jacket?  In my googling I didn't find that very pattern, but that's mostly what came up with 'matinee jacket'.  All of the ones that DID come up were made the same way, which is what I surmised from your description.  You started with the neckline, then made increases probably in 4 places (usually at either side of the sleeve), and you are at the point where you are dividing between back, 2 sleeves, and 2 fronts.  Right now it looks like a cape more or less .

Just talking thru the math here -you start with 128 stitches.  The 2 sets of 24 skipped stitches will become the sleeves, presumably you will come back and finish those later.  After you skip the combined 48 stitches for the sleeves, you should be left with 128 minus 48 = 80 stitches.  These 80 stitches will be the front and back.  21 (one front) plus 38 (back) plus 21 (other front) = 80 stitches.

What's confusing me a little about the wording of the instruction is--I would have expect it to say (simplified): make 21 stitches (front) , skip 24 (sleeve), make 38 stitches (back),skip 24 (sleeve), make 21 stitches (front), turn.  Does this help / make sense?  The first time I made a top like this I thought it was very strange (was not visualizing the giant fold created by the many slipped stitches as the sleeve/armhole) until I finished the row you were on, then it sort of folded itself and magically looked like a jacket and I thought it was really ingenious.  :idea

 

Edited by Granny Square

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Thank you for the reply.  I understand what you are saying.  However, the pattern says that there will be 42 stitches for the back and I can only get 40.  Am I looking at this wrong?

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Did you count the 2 increases? 

 "3 ch, 1 tr in first st, 1 tr in each of next 38 sts, 2 tr in next st"

3 ch + 1 tr in first st is an increase. 2 tr in next st is the second increase. 

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Now I see I missed two extra stitches across the back where the increases were made, sorry.

" with WS facing miss 24 sts, rejoin yarn in next st, 3 ch, 1 tr in first st, 1 tr in each of next 38 sts, 2 tr in next st, turn (42 sts)    What I missed is that there are 2 increases here made into 2 stitches I hadn't counted before --  so there are 40 stitches across the back before you started this (2 now with increases at each end, and 38 between them, new total 42 in the back.)

Question--you didn't mention how many stitches you did on the first front before skipping 24 for the first sleeve, and I assumed it was the same number as the second front (21), since I misread and assumed that you were starting with 38 not 40 across the back, and also assumed that the 2 fronts matched, and that all added up to 128.  Now that I realize I missed 2 back stitches, the number of stitches has to have been 19 (not 21) for the first front--which is odd, because I'd think the fronts should have the same number of stitches.  (Unless there's a button band to be added later on that side?)  To have had 128 stitches before starting the current row, you'd have had to have them distributed as 19 (front) + 24 (sleeve) + 40 (back) +24 (sleeve) +21 (front).  Now, this current row adds 2 stitches (1 on each side of the back), so you should have 130 minus 48 for the sleeves, so 82 remaining around the back and fronts.

So, I hope you see what I'm trying to reconcile here, and how you can do a sanity check on how you should have had enough stitches if you started with 128.  Are the front, back and sleeve counts before and after as I'm counting them? 

Hi Redroses, we were typing together (again).  Yeah, I missed the stitches the increases went into.  But as you see above, that takes away from the other front, if you are starting with 128.

 

Edited by Granny Square

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The right front is 3 ch, miss first stitch, 1 tr in each of next 18 sts, 2 tr in next st, turn (21 st)

the left front is with WS facing, miss 24, rejoin yarn in next st, 3 ch, 1 tr in first st, 1 tr in each st to end, turn (21 st)

Edited by Sherri Hicks

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So the fronts each have an increase. 

Here's the math...

Ch3 + 18 tr + inc tr = 21 stitches in 20 stitches. 

Miss 24.

Ch3, tr (increase) + 38 tr + inc tr = 42 stitches in 40 stitches. 

Miss 24.

Ch3, tr (increase) + 19 tr = 21 stitches in 20 stitches. 

Previous row is 20 + 24 + 40 + 24 + 20 = 128.

New row is 21 front, 42 back, 21 front.

Does this help?

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How do you know that there is an increase when the pattern says 1 tr in first st---I took it that this meant 1 triple crochet in first stitch--it doesn't say to increase, however, it does make sense. 

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It said to attach yarn in a stitch, chain 3, then treble in the same stitch.  The chain 3 normally takes the place of a stitch/counts as a stitch, so that puts 2 (functional) stitches into 1 stitch, therefore an increase.  

Actually I think I was wondering why it said to 'reattach the yarn, chain 3' in the first place, because you were just skipping stitches and the yarn should have still been on the hook and you should have just been able to make a treble there after skipping.  No excuse for my missing the stitch in the same spot though, sorry if I confused you and I'm glad that Redrosesdz straightened out the stitch miscounts.  Hope all is OK now?

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As granny square said, a ch3 to chain up counts as a stitch. 

Normally crochet stitches start at the top of a stitch. When you turn or attach with a slip stitch, you're at the bottom of the stitch. You chain up to get the right height.

For shorter stitches, the chain up doesn't count as a stitch. The first stitch is in the first < and the last stitch is in the last <.

For taller stitches, the chain up counts as a stitch. The first actual taller stitch is in the second  < and is stitch #2. The last stitch is in the top of the previous row's chain up.

When you do a taller stitch in the first <, you're actually doing 2 stitches in the same stitch, aka an increase. 

Here are the rules for UK stitches...

dc - ch1 that doesn't count as a stitch 

htr - ch2 that sometimes counts as a stitch and sometimes doesn't. The pattern tells you which.

tr - ch3 that counts as a stitch. 

All stitches taller than tr, have a chain up that counts as a stitch. 

Note: people who chain loosely, sometimes do fewer chains for their chain up, i.e. a ch2 for a tr. It doesn't change the rules. 

Edited by redrosesdz

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